TDM: Dec '19 Sign-up

[Charlie Brown]

HELLO ALL,

Next month, we're going to do the Lenormand-and-Qndynes inspired pairing spread that we referenced last month.

Next year, I've got some great ideas in mind. New cross spreads, more tableau, some Jodorowsky-authored spreads, and more.

This month, however, we're going to keep things a little more loose and open:

If you've participated in this circle before, then it's dealer's choice. Pick/do whatever you want.

If this is your first time participating in this circle, then I ask that you get your feet wet with a standard 3 or 5 card cartomantic line. Our practice here is broad and varied but we have a couple of suggestions about how one approaches the three-card layout with TdM. This is not mean to be limiting, nor will it likely need apply to the experienced TdM reader. Rather, it's meant to underscore (especially to the modern intuitive reader) that the TdM is as much an attitude as it is a particular deck pattern.

Please peruse our September assignment.

If you want to see people's readings in response to that prompt, here's the archive.

Finally, if you're looking for some quick, dirty, holiday fun with the TdM suitable for parties and loved ones, I'd refer you to my ever-popular (at least in my own mind) Christmas Tree Fortune Telling Spread

We did this last December, right here.

Cheers and Happy Holidays!

[Diana]

Charlie Brown: Did I miss somewhere who reads for who ? Or hasn't this been arranged yet ?

[Charlie Brown]

We're still having sign-ups. I guess what's missing are the dates.

[Rachelcat]

I can't do any circles this month, but I LOVE your Christmas tree spread! Is it ok if I bump up the spread thread? (I'm a poet and don't know it.)

[Charlie Brown]

I can't do any circles this month, but I LOVE your Christmas tree spread! Is it ok if I bump up the spread thread? (I'm a poet and don't know it.)

Please do!

[Charlie Brown]

Ok. So as expected we're having a light turnout this month. Diana and Belenus, you two will pair off. Dealer's choice. Since it's just the two of you, why don't you post your readings and feedback in this thread. Readings are due by the 22nd, feedback by the end of the year.

Next month, I imagine we'll have a full roster again.

[Diana]

Hi Belenus. It's cool that I can read for you.

What's on your mind and how can the Tarot of Marseilles and me be of service ?

[Belenus]

Hi Diana,

Sorry for being such a noob here. It took me forever to find the post you referred to in your PM to me. I think this is the right area, yes? So do I post my question here for you to read and reply to? Confused because the subject line is "TDM: Dec '19 Sign-up.

all the best,
B

[Diana]

Yes, Charlie Brown suggested we do it here as there are only two of us this month. Everyone else is probably busy decorating their trees or organising an escape route from the end of year festive season. I think one of the usual crowd is actually building a tunnel under the sea which lands up in the Seychelles or something.

I don't have a question for you yet. By tomorrow one will appear.

[Charlie Brown]

Hi Diana,

Sorry for being such a noob here. It took me forever to find the post you referred to in your PM to me. I think this is the right area, yes? So do I post my question here for you to read and reply to? Confused because the subject line is "TDM: Dec '19 Sign-up.

all the best,
B

No worries but, yet again, I put a link to the post directly into your message. All you had to do was click.

[Diana]

No worries but, yet again, I put a link to the post directly into your message. All you had to do was click.

Belenus was referring to a PM I sent earlier saying I'd posted to ask what the reading would be about. You didn't know this of course. In which I didn't put the link because I was feeling lazy. But it's true, you had sent the link in your PM. Bad Belenus. No supper for you tonight and definitely no dessert !!

[Belenus]

No worries but, yet again, I put a link to the post directly into your message. All you had to do was click.

Belenus was referring to a PM I sent earlier saying I'd posted to ask what the reading would be about. You didn't know this of course. In which I didn't put the link because I was feeling lazy. But it's true, you had sent the link in your PM. Bad Belenus. No supper for you tonight and definitely no dessert !!

<SIGH> No supper, no dessert? Sadly I had planned on neither. LOL Had a molar extracted, and dentist has me on a yogurt, milkshake diet for a few days. OH the tragedy of it all!

[Diana]

But yoghurt and milkshake are desserts. You're on a dessert diet !!!

[Belenus]

But yoghurt and milkshake are desserts. You're on a dessert diet !!!

Well. I have learned what brand of yoghurt NOT to buy!

as to my question for a reading, besides asking what is the best yoghurt to buy - do you want something complicated and deep, or since we are just getting to know each other - something simple and a tad more prosaic?

Belenus

[Diana]

Let's do something simple. Simple can be poetic or prosaic, so let's leave that up to the Tarot to decide. Let's leave the darkest corners of our minds dark for the moment. They're used it by now so they'll be okay.

[Belenus]

Let's do something simple. Simple can be poetic or prosaic, so let's leave that up to the Tarot to decide. Let's leave the darkest corners of our minds dark for the moment. They're used it by now so they'll be okay.

Diana,

I have taken up the study of Lenormand over the past 6 months or so - during a lot of down-time because of some very challenging health crises. Truth be told, Lenormand is taking longer to become adept at it than I ever imagined. I have studied and read tarot for almost 50 years. My amazing, skilled, and VERY patient Lenormand teacher Serge Pirotte (definitely a master cartomancer) has told me several times that it is far harder to go from Tarot to Lenormand, than it is to go from Lenormand to tarot. My experience is that he is correct! Despite the fact that he thinks I am doing really great and should put myself out there, I lack the confidence and comfort enough to "go public."

My query: "What can I do (i.e., concrete action(s)) to enable a comfortable competency with Lenormand?"

Prosaic, yes, poetic, nah! -- But a good way to get the ball rolling methinks.

[Diana]

So I'll do this reading for you early next week. Too much going on in the next few days to find a quiet space in my mind for card reading.

Here's my question. I want to take up some regular physical activity - one that is good for the mind and body, probably early on in the new year. I've narrowed my options down to three :

1) Tai Chi
2) Yoga
3) Classical ballet for adults

Ballet : As I'm 60, the classical ballet will probably make me look like a right dunce, but it's designed for women of all ages. I love the music too. I did a lot of ballet in my youth and I feel nostalgic sometimes.

Yoga - I've tried it a couple of times, but never kept it up. But I always felt very good when I left the class. I think I never kept it up because I didn't find a teacher whom I was comfortable with. And I don't want to do mantras and things like that.

Tai Chi - never tried, but it's always attracted my attention when I read or hear about it. It looks like a great practice.

Does the Tarot have a preference for me ? Or does it think all three options are a terrible idea ?

[Belenus]

So I'll do this reading for you early next week. Too much going on in the next few days to find a quiet space in my mind for card reading.

Here's my question. I want to take up some regular physical activity - one that is good for the mind and body, probably early on in the new year. I've narrowed my options down to three :

1) Tai Chi
2) Yoga
3) Classical ballet for adults

Ballet : As I'm 60, the classical ballet will probably make me look like a right dunce, but it's designed for women of all ages. I love the music too. I did a lot of ballet in my youth and I feel nostalgic sometimes.

Yoga - I've tried it a couple of times, but never kept it up. But I always felt very good when I left the class. I think I never kept it up because I didn't find a teacher whom I was comfortable with. And I don't want to do mantras and things like that.

Tai Chi - never tried, but it's always attracted my attention when I read or hear about it. It looks like a great practice.

Does the Tarot have a preference for me ? Or does it think all three options are a terrible idea ?

Thanks! I will work on this the next few days. It seems the one option is to do 3 different lay of the cards because there are 3 choices to choose among - rather than just a single line of 5 or 7. Thus one spread for each option.

Or I could rephrase the question (something I hesitate to do without the querent's firm OK) to: "What is the best regular physical activity for Diana in the New Year of 2020?" Then we might find that the Tarot suggests none of those 3 options, or one of the 3 clearly.

What do you think? I am absolutely comfortable with either approach.

Respectfully,
Belenus

[Diana]

Or I could rephrase the question (something I hesitate to do without the querent's firm OK) to: "What is the best regular physical activity for Diana in the New Year of 2020?" Then we might find that the Tarot suggests none of those 3 options, or one of the 3 clearly.

Oh, I'm happy to make it simple. If you are. As you know what the three options are, the Tarot will know as well so I don't think it matters that you're formulating it in a more vague manner. The options underlie the question without your even mentioning them. The Tarot is omniscient anyway.

I reckon one or more of these options will be apparent in the reading. But of course, there may be a fourth option I hadn't thought of, like wrestling or pole dancing. Who knows ? The Tarot works in mysterious ways.

Thank you.

[Belenus]

Or I could rephrase the question (something I hesitate to do without the querent's firm OK) to: "What is the best regular physical activity for Diana in the New Year of 2020?" Then we might find that the Tarot suggests none of those 3 options, or one of the 3 clearly.

Oh, I'm happy to make it simple. If you are. As you know what the three options are, the Tarot will know as well so I don't think it matters that you're formulating it in a more vague manner. The options underlie the question without your even mentioning them. The Tarot is omniscient anyway.

I reckon one or more of these options will be apparent in the reading. But of course, there may be a fourth option I hadn't thought of, like wrestling or pole dancing. Who knows ? The Tarot works in mysterious ways.

Thank you.

Someday, once I know folks well enough - I must share a reading I did for a woman, in which I could not get out of my mind that the answer was "Pole-Dancing"! LOL

[Belenus]

Or I could rephrase the question (something I hesitate to do without the querent's firm OK) to: "What is the best regular physical activity for Diana in the New Year of 2020?" Then we might find that the Tarot suggests none of those 3 options, or one of the 3 clearly.

Oh, I'm happy to make it simple. If you are. As you know what the three options are, the Tarot will know as well so I don't think it matters that you're formulating it in a more vague manner. The options underlie the question without your even mentioning them. The Tarot is omniscient anyway.

I reckon one or more of these options will be apparent in the reading. But of course, there may be a fourth option I hadn't thought of, like wrestling or pole dancing. Who knows ? The Tarot works in mysterious ways.

Thank you.

Hi, Diana! Thank you for giving me the opportunity to read for you. I choose a spread, that I learned from Andy Boroveshengra’s blog. He attributes to the great French Tarot reader, Colette Silvestre. The name of this spread is “Le Tirage des Messages.”

Here are what the five positions indicate:

The first position in the spread gives us the state of mind of the querent who is facing her question.

The second position describes the present situation of the querent.

The third position describes the behavior, the actions, that she should take.

The fourth position describes the behavior or actions that she should avoid.

The fifth position describes the answer.

I believe the spread indicates, more or less clearly, that the new physical activity you should undertake Diana in year 2020 is Tai Chi.

Delineation: “How did I get that answer?"

In the first position we have the ever revolving Wheel of Fortune. The state of mind that you are experiencing is one of going round and round and round and round, about what new physical activity you should undertake. In my assessment of this Major, the point of the wheel of fortune is that it always keeps going around, it never seems to stop. Just when you get to the top, you slide down and start the cycle all over again.

In the second position, which describes your present situation, we have the Hermit. Notice how the hermit is illuminating the ever circling, cycling mind of indecision, and “what should I do?” The hermit - you - are searching for the answer. The hermit looks carefully, intently, seeking to shed light on what is the best outcome, the best answer. But notice that he is stationary, whereas the wheel constantly turns.

Throughout this thread, the very first thing I noticed, was the yin-yang of the whole spread. The left side has motion, the right side has stasis. Yet the answer, position #5, gives us motion again. I feel that this initial overview will yield important information as to what is the best option of the three that you gave me.

Let's get to position #4 and then we'll come back to position #3. What should you avoid doing? You should avoid sitting on your keister and studying yet more options, evaluating, thinking, etc. La Papess simply sits and observes and lets the world go by. Yet, notice WHAT she is looking at. She observes the woman with the lion in position #3, La Force. It is as if in her reflection and study of her options, she looks up from her mulling and study, and now clearly sees the answer of what she must do.

What must you do (position #3)? I see a woman who is embracing perhaps her inner lion/power. Notice how in this deck it's almost as if the lion is part of the lower half of the woman. We see no back of the lion, nor do we see the woman’s other foot - they are truly merged into one. Her inner “force”, her inner desire, strength, is is visualized, and projected into the image of the lion.

Some might see in this card, a sense of domination and control. I do not. Is she opening the lion's mouth? Or is she closing and holding it shut? Perhaps she is doing both. What I see here is a certain give and take, a playful, artful taming, and yielding, a flow seems to emerge from this card. The woman is learning to gently, intentionally, gracefully, "control" her body, her movements, her intention. Of the three options that you gave me this seems to point towards Tai Chi. But I still need more confirmation. So I look to the fifth card to see what is the answer.

The answer, as shown in card #5, is Temperance. Temperance is presented here, as a back and forth flow, a continuous motion. She gracefully and skillfully balances the mixture. Notice not a drop is spilled. In the time of the creation of these cards, a common practice was to “temper” the wine served at a meal. To do this, water was mixed with wine – to yield a balanced, palatable, mixture. The idea of mixing different substances – water as yin, wine as yang – speaks to the action of this woman in achieving a perfect balance and flow. Further we know that the verb “to temper” also refers to the process of making something stronger and more resilient through the skillful mixing of different substances. Isn’t that the intention of your desire for physical activity in 2020? A stronger, more resilient body and mind?Again knowing what I know about Tai Chi, this card and its meaning, would seem to symbolize the flowing, back and forth, gently moving, very fluid circular actions of Tai Chi versus the more static postures of yoga.

Why do I not see ballet in this spread? At least two reasons. There is no indication of dancing in any of these cards. I would have expected perhaps Le Soleil for that. Instead we have a left side/active right side/passive visual symmetry in the spread. Again that visual to me, from my experiences of doing Tai Chi, is very reminiscent of that basically standing in place for the most part, and yet one continues to flow and move in gentle circles and arcs! Yes — Circles! But back to card #1 – here we see circular motion, while card #3 shows us the give-and-take, the back-and-forth, and so does card #5. Continuous motion in the midst of stillness. Again to my mind this speaks most clearly to Tai Chi.

If you want to go further, or have any questions, please do not hesitate to ask me. Please let me know what you think. I hope you've enjoyed my journey with the Burdel Tarot de Marseille in searching for an answer to your query. (The Burden TdM is truly one of my go-to, favorite decks.)

Respectfully,
Paul

[Diana]

That was quick! Thank you. Feedback will be given at some point today. Thanks for using this little used deck. It's a Swiss deck. Fribourg is not far from where I live. I've always wished to go and dive into their archives to explore more about who this Claude Burdel was. I'd love to know whether there are any of his ancestors still living in the area or in Switzerland.

[Diana]

Hi, Diana! Thank you for giving me the opportunity to read for you. I choose a spread, that I learned from Andy Boroveshengra’s blog. He attributes to the great French Tarot reader, Colette Silvestre. The name of this spread is “Le Tirage des Messages.”

Great spread and very fitting for the issue at hand.

I had one of Colette Silvestre's books (in French) when I started out with Tarot. A couple of decades ago. But I don't remember it being anything remarkable. But it was obviously one of her early books so I can't judge on what she's doing today. I'll go and see if my local library stocks any of her books and see if she can wow me today, but I'm not holding my breath. In fact, I'd forgotten about her. But we're not here to discuss Colette Silvestre, so pardon me for my musings.

Anyhow it's a great spread like I said and am glad you chose it.

In the first position we have the ever revolving Wheel of Fortune. The state of mind that you are experiencing is one of going round and round and round and round, about what new physical activity you should undertake. In my assessment of this Major, the point of the wheel of fortune is that it always keeps going around, it never seems to stop. Just when you get to the top, you slide down and start the cycle all over again.

In the second position, which describes your present situation, we have the Hermit. Notice how the hermit is illuminating the ever circling, cycling mind of indecision, and “what should I do?” The hermit - you - are searching for the answer. The hermit looks carefully, intently, seeking to shed light on what is the best outcome, the best answer. But notice that he is stationary, whereas the wheel constantly turns.

Throughout this thread, the very first thing I noticed, was the yin-yang of the whole spread. The left side has motion, the right side has stasis. Yet the answer, position #5, gives us motion again. I feel that this initial overview will yield important information as to what is the best option of the three that you gave me.

All clear as a bell. We seem to have some kind of similar background and/or approach to the TdM, so I hear you loud and clear.

I really like how you talk about the motion of the spread as being yin-yang. It's really that isn't it. Already in the vocabulary used, there's a sense that we're going somewhere Asian. I really like how you emphasise these two sides. Thanks for that.

Let's get to position #4 and then we'll come back to position #3. What should you avoid doing? You should avoid sitting on your keister and studying yet more options, evaluating, thinking, etc. La Papess simply sits and observes and lets the world go by. Yet, notice WHAT she is looking at. She observes the woman with the lion in position #3, La Force. It is as if in her reflection and study of her options, she looks up from her mulling and study, and now clearly sees the answer of what she must do.

What must you do (position #3)? I see a woman who is embracing perhaps her inner lion/power. Notice how in this deck it's almost as if the lion is part of the lower half of the woman. We see no back of the lion, nor do we see the woman’s other foot - they are truly merged into one. Her inner “force”, her inner desire, strength, is is visualized, and projected into the image of the lion.

Some might see in this card, a sense of domination and control. I do not. Is she opening the lion's mouth? Or is she closing and holding it shut? Perhaps she is doing both. What I see here is a certain give and take, a playful, artful taming, and yielding, a flow seems to emerge from this card. The woman is learning to gently, intentionally, gracefully, "control" her body, her movements, her intention. Of the three options that you gave me this seems to point towards Tai Chi. But I still need more confirmation. So I look to the fifth card to see what is the answer.

I had never heard of a keister. I had to look it up. It's a North American word. Is it regional ? It's odd I've never read it in a book or anywhere. Is it a word that is commonly used?

Yes, all that so beautifully described and well interpreted. I like how you play with words. It's very elegant and colourful. I like the artful taming and the yielding. I really don't have much feedback to give on your reading because it's just a sort of "nod, yes" "nod, yes yes", "nod, I absolutely agree".

Actually, I think the character in the Strength card is maybe removing the teeth of the lion . There's a thread on CoT about Strength and her Weirdness and I mention this there. It's an interesting thread. It's not about teeth - it's about all the weirdness of this card. viewtopic.php?f=128&t=1783&p=12449&hilit=teeth#p12449

I'm only half joking. But it's more of an anectode - or a sort of a story within a story. One of those tarot legends and lore (that I just invented but now it's in cyberspace so will go on and on for eternity or until cyberspace is wiped out. Legends always start somewhere... why not on CoT?)

The answer, as shown in card #5, is Temperance. Temperance is presented here, as a back and forth flow, a continuous motion. She gracefully and skillfully balances the mixture. Notice not a drop is spilled. In the time of the creation of these cards, a common practice was to “temper” the wine served at a meal. To do this, water was mixed with wine – to yield a balanced, palatable, mixture. The idea of mixing different substances – water as yin, wine as yang – speaks to the action of this woman in achieving a perfect balance and flow. Further we know that the verb “to temper” also refers to the process of making something stronger and more resilient through the skillful mixing of different substances. Isn’t that the intention of your desire for physical activity in 2020? A stronger, more resilient body and mind?Again knowing what I know about Tai Chi, this card and its meaning, would seem to symbolize the flowing, back and forth, gently moving, very fluid circular actions of Tai Chi versus the more static postures of yoga.

When I went to Italy, I notice they still mix water and wine, at least in the more popular working class restaurants. Mostly at lunchtime. They mix water with the wine so they can still have a nice taste of wine without getting drunk for work. That's what I was told anyway. It's very refreshing actually on a hot day.

Why do I not see ballet in this spread? At least two reasons. There is no indication of dancing in any of these cards. I would have expected perhaps Le Soleil for that. Instead we have a left side/active right side/passive visual symmetry in the spread. Again that visual to me, from my experiences of doing Tai Chi, is very reminiscent of that basically standing in place for the most part, and yet one continues to flow and move in gentle circles and arcs! Yes — Circles! But back to card #1 – here we see circular motion, while card #3 shows us the give-and-take, the back-and-forth, and so does card #5. Continuous motion in the midst of stillness. Again to my mind this speaks most clearly to Tai Chi.

If you want to go further, or have any questions, please do not hesitate to ask me. Please let me know what you think. I hope you've enjoyed my journey with the Burdel Tarot de Marseille in searching for an answer to your query. (The Burden TdM is truly one of my go-to, favorite decks.)

Tai Chi it will be. It was anyway the option that made the most sense to me. The one I was the most leaning to. But if you'd told me ballet or pole dancing, I'd have followed your advice strictly and to the letter.

THANK YOU SO MUCH !!!! After that reading, there's not a single bit of doubt in my mind. And now I'll get my body aligned a bit more with what's going on in my head. There is a bit of an imbalance.

You're a good reader. Someone one can trust with the cards.

Now will you tell us your reading that you did for that woman and the pole dancing episode ? You know us all so much better than you did last night, so I think you should be ready.

[Diana]

Belenus, the reading I will be doing for you is delayed a couple of days. Some unexpected events have caused a bit of a pickle (euphemism) in my time management. I have blocked a period to do it on Thursday morning (19th Dec.)

It's a funny expression "to be in a pickle". So I looked it up. The origin of the phrase in a pickle seems to stem from two different places. First, there is the sixteenth century Dutch phrase in de pekel zitten which literally translates as sitting in the pickle, meaning to be drunk. Second, there is the Shakespeare play The Tempest, in which Alonso asks “How camest thou in this pickle?” and Trinculo answers “I have been in such a pickle since I saw you last that, I fear me, will never out of my bones…” In this case the phrase in a pickle also refers to being drunk, in time it came to mean to be in a difficult situation or in a quandry.

[Belenus]

Please do not worry. I am perfectly OK with it, when it is most convenient for you. Take your time, do not stress.

all my best to you,
Belenus