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Palmistry: An Introduction of Sorts

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This area is for discussions of all the esoteric practices that don't have a specific category on this forum. There are so many fascinating things that people who read tarot also engage in that enhance and enrich their lives and their cartomancy endeavours.

Please feel free to share or inquire about anything you like in regards to esoteric, divination and spiritual traditions.

If any category in this area starts to break out a bit, I will create it's own sub-forum.
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Joan Marie
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Palmistry: An Introduction of Sorts

Post by Joan Marie »

Recently one of our Cult of Tarot members, dodalisque, gave us an extensive interview about the practice of hypnotism and trance states. You can see that here:
Hypnotism & Tarot: Insight into the Unconscious

In the interview, he said that he uses palmistry to help him understand the kind of client he's working with and what techniques will be most effective for inducing a trance state.

In a follow-up to the interview I asked him to elaborate on that. The response he gave was so interesting and complete I though that it could also stand alone as a kind of introduction to palmistry. The following post is a copy of that response.

I'm attaching a couple of pics here from a book I have called Cheiro's Guide to the Hand from 1899. They might help locate some of the lines that are referred to in the post.

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Re: Palmistry: An Introduction of Sorts

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We don't find it strange to think that we can get a feel for someone's character by looking at their face. Online dating sites are built on this premise. But recent brain research has shown that the colossal number of motor and neuron connections to the hands and fingers is 14 times larger than that assigned to the face, including the eyes and mouth. About a third of all brain activity involves the hands. Handwriting analysis is thought to be a reliable gauge to character, or was, before people were given computers and iphones and lost the ability to hold a pen. To a large extent, we ARE our hands.

This model was made to show how our body looks to our own brain. It does have a name but I can't find it on Google at the moment:

main-qimg-da605a0ac1f2b7ba5a341eaa62713dae-c.jpg

I haven't forgotten your question but, in my own ponderous way, I just need to back up a little. There are several systems of palmistry, each with its own vocabulary for discussing how to interpret lines and various types of information visible on the hand. The most popular in our culture is based on the Four Elements, which as metaphors for various aspects of human psychology are very familiar to us from the 4 tarot suits. The palm itself is divided up into quadrants that correspond to earth/air/fire/water. There are four main lines on the hand that are common to just about everyone - life/head/fate/heart - and each of these is also associated respectively with earth/air/fire/water. When you understand the language of the hand it is actually very similar to doing a tarot reading.

The development of palmistry as a respectable science came about by the collecting and analysing of masses of data correlating features on the hand with observable behavior. Isn't that how astrology built up its associations of zodiac signs to different personality types? Both astrology and palmistry are branches of empirical science, though admittedly still in their infancy even after several thousand years of data collection.

Interpreting the lines on the palm is actually a small part of palmistry. There are hundreds of pieces of information that need to be evaluated in a full reading, including fingerprints, palm ridges, nails, the fingers, their size and shape and spacing, and how they lean towards or away from each other, the relative length of the phalanges on each finger, the mounds and the base of each finger, skin texture , the firmness of the flesh, and even hand gestures. The lines on the hand might be thought of as rivers of energy, showing how we apportion energy to different areas of our life.

A real palm reading takes at least a couple of hours and involves a magnifying glass and ink palm prints of both hands. I like to take home the information and sleep on it before I put my reading together. There are so many individual bits of information to correlate, most of it contradictory, since we are all such a unique combination of conflicting qualities that, as in a tarot reading, the conscious mind is not up to the task and we need to rely on the much faster and more subtle intelligence of intuition.

For example, I noticed in my first quick glance that a certain client's fate line on her right hand began, not as usual low down on the hand just above the wrist, but above half way up the palm; she also showed indicators of advanced communication skills (a little finger that stood away from the other fingers); and she had a long clear deep upward-curving heart line suggesting a warm heart. Without even thinking it popped out of my mouth, "You didn't take up teaching until your own kids had left home, did you?"

Isn't that similar to the way our mind works when we are doing a tarot reading? The indicators point to a specific scenario that is the only way to reconcile them all. We might even get a picture in our mind, a sort of misty vision, of the client teaching in front of a class. Our intuition has even worked out that she was teaching young children between the ages of 6 and 8, though it was probably factoring in more than the three indicators mentioned above.

The constant back and forth comparison of both hands is also essential since, by and large, for a right-handed person, the left hand shows what we were born with and the right hand shows what we have done with that. A tiny little Chinese woman who worked nights in the bakery where I worked for 15 years and who ran the place and could do the work of 5 men had a remarkably discrepancy between her two hands. The left hand was a mess - she should have been in a mental asylum or dead - whereas the right hand was a model of balance and health. It turned out she was very sickly as a child but her grandmother was a wizard at acupuncture and had devoted 10 years of intensive treatment, hours every day, to her beloved grand-daughter. She had essentially rewired the entire nervous system.

The lines on the hand are in no way related to the way we habitually fold the hands during our daily occupations. In fact the basic layout of the lines on each individual's hands is established after just 3 months in the womb. This suggests that we come into this life already programmed to be one way or another with specific skills and abilities. Isn't this what DNA research tells us too? Palmistry and DNA analysis have a lot in common.

Having said that, we are not chained to that way of being. If we change our behaviour we will also make observable small changes to the lines on our hands. It's fascinating to takes palm prints every two weeks for a year and then compare them to diary entries for the same period. Losing a job or boyfriend or even buying a new car will initiate microscopic or dramatic changes to the lines. Quite detailed medical issues can be picked up in the lines months or even years before a doctor has examined you. The unconscious knows your body has a problem a long time before it is felt or is outwardly noticeable.

But to answer your original question, some people are highly analytical and stubborn about surrendering conscious control to allow themselves to go into trance. This is the sort of person who is highly anxious and self-conscious and can never be persuaded to get up on a dance floor or let their hair down. A very long straight head line could be one indicator of this type of person, but there are dozens. If the head line droops down at the end to move into the lower quadrant of the palm on the percussion (non-thumb) side of the hand, or even splits into two ("the writer's fork") the client probably has a talent for trance.

The analytical type will tend to resist direct commands from a hypnotist, and you need to be more subtle about planting suggestions and about hypnotising them with a different set of techniques. For those who are more at home in the world of the unconscious, the hypnotherapist will adopt a more forceful personality (more like a stage hypnotist) and give simple direct commands. Between those two extremes there are shades of difference and a quick examination of a few pointers on the hands will give you a snapshot of the kind of person you are talking to.

After a while the whole process becomes quite intuitive. A skilled palmist can glance at a hand the same way you glance at someone's face out of the corner of your eye. I don't make a checklist and consciously decide to adopt one course over another. We do this all the time when we get a feel for someone we have just met. A woman hypnotherapist with a sharp sense of intuition won't even need to worry about palmistry. She will just pick up on body language, or a vibe, and find herself behaving in a certain way to the client and selecting a certain technique without any analysis whatsoever. I don't have that level of sensitivity so a few palmistry pointers help me to get a feel for each client.

Usually once I have checked out someone's thumb and forefinger, and maybe the head line, I don't need to know much more, though there may be unexpected contrary indicators here and there. The thumb is how we grip things, our great evolutionary advantage, so not surprisingly is linked to how we use our willpower. A big powerful long stiff straight thumb indicates someone of the "highly analytical" type, a tough customer. If he also has a longer than average forefinger - the one we point at people to threaten them - this will confirm the diagnosis. The forefinger usually relates to issues around the ego. Some like Trump will overcompensate for a smaller than average forefinger. Hence the bluster. Hilary Clinton has a huge forefinger, so a bit overconfident.

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People with long fingers in relation to their overall height and hand size are always detail-oriented. Jewellers and watch-makers all have long fingers. People with short little fingers will be more impatient, less methodical and cautious and more , well, more "suit of Wands". That is what we are born to do and will find easiest, but many choose jobs to which they are not suited at all. I'm amazed how often I find super-sensitive psychic types in high stress jobs in the city, suffering like hell, when they would be much happier and more fulfilled renting deck chairs on a beach somewhere.

I hated those questionnaires that we junior hypnotherapists were encouraged to give to clients to help us decide how best to hypnotise them. The conscious mind fills out questionnaires, and the conscious mind, the ego, is terrible at evaluating one's own true nature. Hands, which are expressions of unconscious wisdom, are a lot smarter and more reliable.

JM, I hope this answers your question. Ask me again if it doesn't. I'm sure I can be brief and to the point if I put my mind to it. Part of the problem is that I don't spend much time thinking nowadays - I grew up all Swords but switched to Cups after I had children - so it takes me a while to figure out what I actually think about these issues myself.
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Re: Palmistry: An Introduction of Sorts

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We don't find it strange to think that we can get a feel for someone's character by looking at their face. Online dating sites are built on this premise. But recent brain research has shown that the colossal number of motor and neuron connections to the hands and fingers is 14 times larger than that assigned to the face, including the eyes and mouth. About a third of all brain activity involves the hands. Handwriting analysis is thought to be a reliable gauge to character, or was, before people were given computers and iphones and lost the ability to hold a pen. To a large extent, we ARE our hands.
I just want to share a quick story that relates to this.

A few years ago, my son was involved in a series of protests in Oakland CA. Though I was proud of his convictions, I was worried. It was making international news almost every day. Every morning when I woke I checked the Bay Area newspapers and one morning there was video of a young man who'd been shot by police by a tear-gas cannister. He was severely injured and the video was a close up of him being shot and carried out by protestors (the cops didn't help him BTW). This kid looked exactly like my son. His face was bloody and dazed and the scene was chaotic, but still the resemblance was strong. I frantically watched that video over and over (it was just a few seconds) looking into that face and really thinking it was my son, until..I looked at his hands and the way he moved them. He was trying to gesture. Instantly, I knew that was not my son. I knew those were not his hands. That was not how his hands move. Even allowing for the injured shocked state he was in, nope. Not how his hands move.

I was so surprised by that. I didn't know how I could be so sure when I wasn't even sure about the face! It didn't make sense, but I was convinced.

The young man who was injured became kind of famous as a result, especially locally. For months, people came up to my son almost every day, asking with concern about his condition. He had to say, "oh, you think I'm..." and the person was always shocked to learn it wasn't. So it wasn't just me!

I never got over how I was able to identify my own son more by hands than face.
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Re: Palmistry: An Introduction of Sorts

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Joan Marie wrote: โ†‘02 Jul 2019, 15:31 Instantly, I knew that was not my son. I knew those were not his hands. That was not how his hands move. Even allowing for the injured shocked state he was in, nope. Not how his hands move.
That's a great story. I don't know if it's connected but I'm always surprised when I watch golf on TV - which I do too often - how I can recognise a player a quarter of a mile away by the distinctive shape of their swing. I mention this because it seems to be another homely expression of the hermetic principle, "As above, so below; as within, so without." Every part of us must be a metaphor for, or an expression of, the whole of our personality. Which might explain why people in the East will stand around watching beloved spiritual masters doing things like playing tennis or chopping up onions: everything they do is an expression of their elevated consciousness. They even trip and fall in their own inimitable fashion. At a deep unconscious level even witnessing that will put us in contact with their radiant soul.
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Re: Palmistry: An Introduction of Sorts

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Not sure that i agree with Dodalisque vis-a-vis spiritual masters, except that when they trip and fall they may be at their most revealing. That said, just the other day i was watching a documentary on Bob Dylan and a number of artists were sitting around playing music which hardly held my interest. But when Dylan sat down at the piano and started to sing I noticed that I was instantly interested - something Joan Baez in the documentary herself said about Dylan's charisma. Now, I say this with some reservation, because I'm not exactly proud of it - or, rather, I don't exactly like my own attraction to Dylan - I just note that it's a phenomenon. Maybe it's true what they say about Dylan, that he made a deal with the devil...

Certainly I have experienced the phenomena many times of recognizing body movement and shape rather than just a face. I recall one day I saw halfway down the block on the other side of the street moving away from me a woman I instantly recognized - yet, I hadn't seen her in over 20 years, since we were teenagers. On the one hand, we look at faces all the time and have become psychologically enmeshed in their every nuance, such that we see faces everywhere - in clouds, rocks, etc. (Speaking of rocks - I saw a new Tarot based on minerals the other day which couldn't help from putting faces into the rocks, so wed are humans with anthropomorphization). On the other hand, our focus on faces causes us to undervalue and underestimate how much we intuit and innately know about gesture, movement, and form.
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Re: Palmistry: An Introduction of Sorts

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Recognising people from their walk is always surprising too. I think a walk may be as distinctive as any other feature of a person.
Actors, especially when they are playing and actual person, spend a lot of time getting down the walk in order to inhabit the character.

I had a friend, (now deceased) who had the strangest walk and I could not put my finger on what it was and then I realised it: he did not swing his arms as he walked. Now try that. Walk forward keeping your arms at your sides.

I tried this, and it felt completely strange. And suddenly I had a deeper understanding of this man. I knew just a little bit of how he "felt" walking down the street. It explained to me a lot about him and his relationship to the world, but only as a feeling, an important one though, without words or judgements.

Since then, I have tried this, (always alone BTW :D ) many times with other people. I notice what it is about a person's gait, a little hitch in the hip or shoulder, an odd position of the foot, a lean forward or to one side, whatever it is, and then I try it. It really puts me kind of inside that person's skin in a really interesting way.
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Re: Palmistry: An Introduction of Sorts

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There is an exercise in ceramics where you shape a piece of clay without looking or thinking about it. Quite often a form will appear from this. The hands can have an intelligence/memory of their own. I think sometimes the hands express themselves when we handle tarot cards. The hands introduce something separate from the intellectual process.
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Re: Palmistry: An Introduction of Sorts

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chiscotheque wrote: โ†‘04 Jul 2019, 01:05 Certainly I have experienced the phenomena many times of recognizing body movement and shape rather than just a face. ...our focus on faces causes us to undervalue and underestimate how much we intuit and innately know about gesture, movement, and form.
Enrique Enriquez, perhaps following an idea of Jean-Claude Flornoy's in his book, "Seeing the World", recommends that as a meditative exercise we adopt the physical posture of the figures on the Tarot de Marseille trump cards. He even demonstrates it during one segment of "Tarology", the wonderful full-length movie about him and his work with the TdM. I think everyone who reads with the TdM or any other tarot card decks for that matter would be inspired by that movie. I was skeptical but something strange does start to happen to your consciousness when you mimic those images. You start to get a very different emotional understanding of the "meaning" of the cards. One's mental state is very much influenced by body posture. If you pull your shoulders back and stand up straight and smile, it's virtually impossible to feel depressed. There really is some truth to the old adage, "Fake it till you make it."(Of course I LIKE to feel depressed so you won't find me indulging in that kind of nonsense very often.)

On the subject of hands we should probably also mention things like hand reflexology and mudras - a complex system of yoga for the hands. They treat the whole body by massaging or stretching areas on the hands that are linked to specific organs and glands. Foot reflexology does the same thing with the feet. Chiropractic muscle testing is rather strange. The chiropractor will ask you specific questions - even obscure questions about your distant past - while requiring you to push against his hand or resist pressure. It's like a lie detector test. If you are giving a true answer - true according to the wisdom of your unconscious - your muscles will be strong and resist the pressure easily. If you give a wrong answer even just a few seconds later, those same muscles have no strength at all and collapse under the pressure. Quite eerie.

Alexander Lowen's system of "Bioenergetics" also explores the way past traumas are stored in our musculature. As specific tense muscle groups are encouraged by certain exercises to relax, vivid repressed memories are released into our consciousness, and the emotional release can be spectacularly cathartic. I remember during a dark period for me in the 80s, my therapist put me in a rather contorting position for a few minutes and asking me to breath in normally then out very slowly. Nothing was happening. Nothing. And I was getting tired. Then all of a sudden I said conversationally, "Ooh, what's this?" And a tiny glow of energy around my solar plexus suddenly spiraled up into the back of my head and set off about 2 minutes of screaming at the absolute top of my lungs and I felt myself blacking out. Then I gradually calmed down and over the next few minutes the surge of energy would overtake me then recede, a little weaker each time. And then it was over. "What the hell was that?" I asked the therapist, but he just told me to go home and enjoy it.

I must say for the next week or ten days I felt marvellous, but I didn't have the concentration or ability to work with the experience at home to trace the energy block back to a particular childhood experience. And in future sessions I never experienced the same thing again, or with anything like the same intensity. I think my conscious mind had learned in the meantime how to re-establish the block. In that first session I had caught it unawares. That's how it felt to me anyway. Doesn't look good though, does it. Oh well. I guess if we weren't meant to repress things there wouldn't be any point in having a subconscious. Or is it heretical to say something like that?
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Re: Palmistry: An Introduction of Sorts

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inomminate wrote: โ†‘04 Jul 2019, 09:02 There is an exercise in ceramics where you shape a piece of clay without looking or thinking about it. Quite often a form will appear from this. The hands can have an intelligence/memory of their own. I think sometimes the hands express themselves when we handle tarot cards. The hands introduce something separate from the intellectual process.
This seems very close to the practise of automatic writing.
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Re: Palmistry: An Introduction of Sorts

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Joan Marie wrote: โ†‘04 Jul 2019, 08:29
Actors...spend a lot of time getting down the walk in order to inhabit the character.
During the making of Jamaica Inn, Hitchcock had to shoot close-ups of Charles Laughton for 10 days because Laughton had not yet found the exact and perfect way of walking for his character.
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Re: Palmistry: An Introduction of Sorts

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dodalisque wrote: โ†‘06 Jul 2019, 05:11
inomminate wrote: โ†‘04 Jul 2019, 09:02 There is an exercise in ceramics where you shape a piece of clay without looking or thinking about it. Quite often a form will appear from this. The hands can have an intelligence/memory of their own. I think sometimes the hands express themselves when we handle tarot cards. The hands introduce something separate from the intellectual process.
This seems very close to the practise of automatic writing.
I had not thought about it like this but I think you are correct.
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Re: Palmistry: An Introduction of Sorts

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chiscotheque wrote: โ†‘04 Jul 2019, 01:05 Not sure that i agree with Dodalisque vis-a-vis spiritual masters, except that when they trip and fall they may be at their most revealing. That said, just the other day i was watching a documentary on Bob Dylan and a number of artists were sitting around playing music which hardly held my interest. But when Dylan sat down at the piano and started to sing I noticed that I was instantly interested - something Joan Baez in the documentary herself said about Dylan's charisma. Now, I say this with some reservation, because I'm not exactly proud of it - or, rather, I don't exactly like my own attraction to Dylan
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Re: Palmistry: An Introduction of Sorts

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I took a book recommendation from the original interview with dodalisque.

I bought "My Voice Will Go With You: The Teaching Tales of Milton Erickson" I just started it but right away it sparked a question.

dodalisque said he uses palmistry to understand his clients before he starts working with them in hypnotherapy. In this book, Erickson uses stories to get a feel for his clients. He said that while telling a story, he watches for small reactions from the client, maybe to a word or something. He'll see a person tense up or react in some way and that gives him big clues as to where the person's "issues" might be hiding. (I am majorly paraphrasing here)

This made me wonder if this technique couldn't be used in live tarot readings. For example. before actually starting, maybe do a little "warm-up" exercise with them, where you just toss out a few cards and see how, with no pressure, the client reacts to "a little story". Like Erickson, you may be able to pick up on little tensions or nervousness at certain words or concepts, that might help you when doing the "serious" reading.

Now I know this is getting dangerously close to the idea of "cold-reading" but that would only depend on your intentions. What I am talking about is trying to communicate as best you can, your findings with the person sitting in front of you. And getting them to relax a bit with a "non-threatening" reading before a real one might be a good technique.

Has anyone done anything like this?
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Re: Palmistry: An Introduction of Sorts

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dodalisque wrote: โ†‘07 Jul 2019, 05:10 That said, just the other day i was watching a documentary on Bob Dylan and a number of artists were sitting around playing music which hardly held my interest. But when Dylan sat down at the piano and started to sing I noticed that I was instantly interested - something Joan Baez in the documentary herself said about Dylan's charisma. Now, I say this with some reservation, because I'm not exactly proud of it - or, rather, I don't exactly like my own attraction to Dylan
This is sort of relevant and sort of not. To preface, I need to say that I was never much of a fan of Baywatch nor did I find Pamela Anderson to be particularly attractive or appealing to me as a screen presence. However, I was once near her in real life and, my gรธd, it's like she's emitting some kind of radiance. She just had this magnetism and literal aura that was almost overwhelming even from 100 feet or so away. Like I said, I was no fan so I wasn't starstruck.
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Re: Palmistry: An Introduction of Sorts

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Charlie Brown wrote: โ†‘03 Aug 2019, 15:58 I was never much of a fan of Baywatch nor did I find Pamela Anderson to be particularly attractive or appealing to me as a screen presence. However, I was once near her in real life and, my gรธd, it's like she's emitting some kind of radiance. She just had this magnetism and literal aura that was almost overwhelming even from 100 feet or so away.
Yes, what exactly is charisma? It's like being photogenic, but not the same thing as being photogenic. Some kind of personal characteristic that seems to have nothing to do with physical attractiveness or confidence or spiritual attainment. To be in a room with someone with charisma is like being next to an electrical transformer, and everyone in the room feels it. Some people look good in hats too, whereas others never do. As in Charlie Brown's example we never guess someone has charisma until see them in the flesh. So maybe it does have an electromagnetic component.
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Re: Palmistry: An Introduction of Sorts

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Joan Marie wrote: โ†‘03 Aug 2019, 13:50 This made me wonder if this technique couldn't be used in live tarot readings. For example. before actually starting, maybe do a little "warm-up" exercise with them, where you just toss out a few cards and see how, with no pressure, the client reacts to "a little story". Like Erickson, you may be able to pick up on little tensions or nervousness at certain words or concepts, that might help you when doing the "serious" reading.

Now I know this is getting dangerously close to the idea of "cold-reading" but that would only depend on your intentions. What I am talking about is trying to communicate as best you can, your findings with the person sitting in front of you. And getting them to relax a bit with a "non-threatening" reading before a real one might be a good technique.

Has anyone done anything like this?
I think too much conscious knowledge of the client might actually get in the way of responding to the cards intuitively. And in any case, I'm not sure many people are equipped to consciously monitor clients for body language signals. Milton Erickson trained himself to do this when he suffered from polio as a young man and was bedridden and virtually paralysed for many years - it recurred in his later years and confined him to a wheelchair. Talking, even breathing, was difficult for him, requiring intense conscious effort, so he became an acute observer of people, often noting the bizarre discrepancies between people's feelings, body language, facial expressions, and the words they used to express themselves. His training as a medical doctor sharpened this ability, and made him sensitive to things like subtle eye movements and breathing patterns. He could read people so accurately that he often gave the impression of possessing occult powers. Erickson was able to internalise this process and make it automatic, but I think for ordinary mortals it's probably better to let our intuition take care of the process. As I said in a reading I did for Max in April in the TdM readings section: "Cold reading has a bad reputation in the tarot world because it suggests that the cards themselves are unnecessary, and that there is an element of deliberate, cynical manipulation of the client's gullibility. But I personally believe there is an element of so-called cold reading, usually unconscious, in all tarot readings. I just object to the term and prefer to think of it as a form of acute sensitivity or telepathy." So, in a nutshell, I think we should just read cards as before and let things take care of themselves.
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Re: Palmistry: An Introduction of Sorts

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dodalisque wrote: โ†‘04 Aug 2019, 20:18 I think too much conscious knowledge of the client might actually get in the way of responding to the cards intuitively. And in any case, I'm not sure many people are equipped to consciously monitor clients for body language signals.
I'm starting to understand that what he was doing with his stories was not "a trick" of any kind. (I'm also starting to understand that I might have trust issues :shock: )

I think what he learned to do so well was to trust his unconscious. Like all of us, he'd stored up a lifetime of experiences, but unlike most of us, he had easy and natural access to it when needed.

I used to teach english to Germans. I was terrible at it when I first started, just following the (really dull) guidelines I'd been given by the school I worked for. Over time though I got really good at thinking up spontaneous "conversation activities." It got to where I really didn't do much prep for the classes (or I could throw out what prep I'd done in a second) because I learned to trust my ability to "find a way" into the day's lesson. Engaging a group of very critical adults (who sometimes didn't even like each other much) into having lively interactions in a second language, and to use humour and to draw on their creative and helpful sides, was pretty satisfying.

Eventually I had a store of good ones (activities), all in my head, and could pull them out as needed and apply them to whatever level we were working at.

Erickson's observation skills combined with his ability to trust himself to "produce appropriate responses" is something, that if one could learn it and internalise it, would be an asset to any profession. Tarot reading for sure.

This is what actors learn to do to take on completely different personae, and it's funny to think how difficult it is to even "take on" one's own persona.

(I appreciate your indulgence as I think out loud here...)
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